Have the Strachan haters got what they deserved?

the time was right for strachan to go irregardless of what happened afterwards. as it so happens the time was definitely right for mowbray to leave the club, and whether or not the next guy in the door manages to win the league or whatever cannot change that fact.

i also don't understand why you and others feel the need to group everyone into categories such as strachan-haters or vennegoor of hesselink-haters. is it cos it just makes it easier for you to deal with the issues by making everything black and white, and as if we are all against each other because we have different opinions on things.

 

Yeah, I get that from you

 

No MON didn't play total football but they were good years he inherited a good team with a good spine. I think MON is harshly judged I don't think they played ugly football.

 

Strachan done a helluva job when he was here under severe pressure from fans who couldnt even raise a voice in support of him after what he had done ,i wasnt one who went ,yes we have Strachan but after the initial problems he had he settled in and i thought he did a fantastic job and he wasnt a Celtic Minded man either ,Some fans couldnt get over that barrier regarding Strachan and even today i am still waiting on a feasable answer to why he shouldnt have been there in the first place .

 

Woe - copy and paste my post where I said i 'hated' Gordon Strachan. You are putting your own interpretation on things.

 

Of course they were good years but MON's Celtic were never lauded for their style but their effectiveness and their ability to get the right result.

I lost count of the amount of times that Larsson got Celtic out of a hole because of his brilliance alone, not the tactics or the system employed by the manager. I remember alot of times where it looked like our tactics had been nullified and up pops Larsson with some magic.

He played effective football and it only looked good because we had just experienced the 90's and we were winning and winning well for the first time in a very very very long time.

 

I agree about the finances, but that doesn't mean that MON wasn't a great manager.

You really believe that qualifying for the last 16 and dropping out two years in a row is better than making the UEFA Cup final? And also, the statistic that I'll use is that it's substantially easier for Scottish clubs to qualify for the CL now, mostly because of the UEFA Cup final appearances by us in '03 and then Rangers are keeping the coefficient total up with their run. We finished first by quite a distance in 01-02 but still had to go through qualification, playing one of the best Basel sides in their history. They qualified out of the first group stages with a group including Liverpool and then almost qualified for the last 8 but lost a tiebreaker to finish third in their second group. Strachan's Celtic qualified directly to the group stages on the back of MON's accomplishment, just like Rangers qualify directly to the group stages based off of '08's accomplishments. It's an easier road than it was, that's a fact.

I've compared budgets before, and those numbers were based off of league play so the strength of the SPL doesn't mean anything. The titles are just as important to me, but you can't say they both mean the same thing. In my opinion, a better gauge would be to look at point totals at the ends of the seasons. Gordon Strachan's highest point total is less than MON's lowest point total. That's incredible to me. Even when Strachan was managing against the PLG debacle he finished with less points than MON finished with the year before, when he came in second. That shows they just weren't playing against the same competition. If you want to throw that out then I really don't know what to say. I haven't thrown out anything yet, I've weighed what matters more or less.

Strachan had nothing to do with balancing the books, it was the board. If Strachan had been offered the same money he would have spent it, don't be ridiculous. GS doesn't have an MBA, he took the conditions the board gave him. He did well with the budget that was afforded him but you're being ridiculous by giving him credit and not the board. Also, why on Earth would I not appreciate being in a good financial position? Really? I don't appreciate it? Strachan was good for what needed to be done. I've never denied that. I was one of his last holdouts so it makes your point of attack really bizarre because you're acting like I was one of the people who never wanted him. He's one of those people who will come in, make everything look rosey on the outside, the players will play for him, and things will go well for a little while. He's a transition manager and we were in a transition. He did his job admirably but he overstayed his welcome. Your comparison of MON and Strachan is crazy, there's no comparison when looking at the talent of the two managers when everything's taken into consideration.

This is where you're not comprehending something. As I said I am a US fan, I have no problem with bad managers getting me results. Our manager is Bob-freaking-Bradley but he got us into the Confederation's Cup final playing hideous, atrocious football but it (barely) works. If Strachan had eeked out that last title I would have loved it and I'd be telling everybody to support him, but the team caved and that falls on him. They weren't responding to him anymore, it was time for him to go. You saying I'm blocking out his achievements is madness, I have fond memories of him but I'm not going to lie to myself and say he was better than MON. I appreciate what he did greatly, but I don't think he's better than MON. It's like you can't understand that by liking MON more that I don't, in fact, hate Strachan. I like both of them for what they did during their entire tenure, I think MON did better. I'm still frustrated at Strachan's side's collapse. Please try to understand this before you reply again.

 

Who lauded them for their effectiveness over their style - you?
Effectiveness is style. I remeber watching a game where we destroyed Hibs in 25 mins and can't remember saying 'oh we are effective'. That day we were stylish.

 

So?

I remember us beating Motherwell 5-0 at Parkhead under Strachan and every goal was brilliant.

Likewise 3-0 against Benfica

Your * into the wind with that argument mate.

 

Let go of the Strachan thing. This is not WGS versus everone else. Say your piece about Gordon and be done with it.

 

Unfortunately people think that if you like MON you have to hate Strachan.

 

I loved them both, 2 of our most successful managers in recent times!

Whats to hate????? Some football fans are hard to please and will write anyone off before they have even had a game in charge!!

ANNOYING

 

The thing I loved about Celtic in those days were how we could keep the fans riveted to their seats due to the passion provided by the players which resulted in so many late goals to take the game.

 

Good thoughtful post Deigan

 

What a stupid thing to post after a well-constructed post before.

Where did anyone say anything to back up that statement?

 

I respected both men for the jobs that they done but more so Strachan in a way because i believe that MON leave Celtic with an ailing team and also a lot of debt ,Strachans budgets were slashed because of this and while he was trying to get his own team together he had to slash the wage bill aswell and i believe he succeeded in doing so while he went on to win the leaague 3 times and won 3 cups aswell as appearing in the last 16 of the Champs twice ,good record from someone who wasnt accepted.

 

Unfortunately he is right because that is what you have been insinuating. If I am correct you brought up the comparision.

 

Opponents, media, football fans....

Strachan was effective ergo he was stylish but why did people not like the style of football, it was effective....?? Explain that one please.

Diegan, we played the best Artmedia side in their history and lost. MON lost to the best ever Basel side, face it he underachieved.

UCL >>>> UEFA Cup/Europa League, financially, competition reputation, media exposure etc. They only way you would exceed the group stages of the UCL is by winning the UEFA Cup.

Once again, you'll use anything to discredit GS.

I dont care about points totals or stats, I care about winning matches and trophies. You can use statistics to devalue someone achievements all you want and prop up another person with them. I'm not bothered with a statistic * contest.

Your are comparing 2 completely different era tbh, despite them being back to back. They TV deal collapse of 2002 was really kicking in 2005 because everyone had borrowed so much the interest payments were effecting bottom lines big time. MON could attract quality players with the money available, Strachan had to take on risks like Gravesen, Donati & Jarosik.

Strachan didnt do the book keeping but he knew what the board wanted done and he did it. He was told to get rid of Agathe Sutton, Hartson, Thompson, Balde because they were outside the new wage structure and find players that could do the job but not cost anywhere near the above. the sooner he did this, the sooner Lawwell could get him higher priced targets of his choice than the freebie bin he was looking through and still win titles. Rangers were in a similar position but they were imploding under PLG because he couldn't do the transition needed for them.

Again, no credit to Strachan, it was all the board and everything and everyone else doing it for him!! He just had to sit in press conferences playing mind games with the hacks!

It required more managerial skill to do what Strachan did and thats a fact

 

Dempsey mentioned numerous times that I wanted to "throw Strachan's achievements away". I took that by saying he thought I didn't like Strachan. I don't think that's an unreasonable assumption. Obviously it's a gross over-exaggeration and borne out of frustration from Dempsey's post, but whenever anybody thinks MON was better than Strachan, many people automatically accuse you of being anti-Strachan.

It was hyperbole but not by much. It's not as stupid as you think and there's a history of it on this forum. It's derived from the even-more irrational anti-Strachan people but that doesn't make it any less annoying.

 

Unfortunately he isn't.

Yes that's right I bought up the comparison, what does that insinuate?

You show me one post where I insinuated I hated MON and I will send you all of my V's.