Why Martin O'Neill was better Celtic manager than Strachan

Why do we need to compare the two? Can we not just be happy that we had two excellent managers?

 

Both did great, both inherited good players, both brought great European nights to Parkhead, both bought great players and duds alike and both had a very successful period at the helm. Strachan in fairness did take advantage of a very weak Rangers team but I think his European record speaks for itself. I respect both and was happy both were our managers I don't feel the need to compare.

 

Both are part of our history and should be respected as that.

2002/03, the best year of my Celtic life in over 40 years of following the Hoops(and l've been to 2 European cup semi's and missed another as l was ill).

Hail Hail

 

WGS constantly sold on too so his net spend was not high. MON basically bought his team for a fortune in the first year and then didnt sell any of them The bottom line is WGS had players with much lower fees and much lower wages on average than MON at a time when players had become far more expensive and well paid. MON could shop in the EPL. That was absolutely impossible for WGS who mostly shopped in the SPL and championship.

There is absolutely no comparison with the complete gift horse of huge money upfront all in his first season that let him buy Sutton, Hartson, Lenny and Thomo plus the core he inherited of Henke, Lambo, Lubo, Stan, Jackie, Mjallby etc. Of the players WGS inherited apart from Stan (who left after a year) they were al done or well past their best within a year of MON leaving - it is telling that not one MON player WGS inherited ever became a regular at at the top level of football again for us or anyone else.

MON was also appalling at finding good permanent signings after the big money had gone. He basically signed noone for 3 or 4 years that were any use. He kept the side he put together in his first year for 5 years and they were in the main done by the time WGS arrived. MON just was no good in the transfer market for us on the sort of wee fees and lower wages and that left us in a sorry state.

WGS was an absolute miracle worker who brought us success with a bunch of 1-2 million quid players on half the wages MON's side was on. The Rangers sides he beat included the only Rangers side to ever do CL last 16 and another Rangers side that went to the UEFA final. The weak Rangers side thing is a myth. If you want a really weak Rangers side try this years.

 

Spot on gunt

I think the dislike for wgs was because of his personality, his history with Celtic, the transformation from mon's era and momentum ( buzz) that went around parkhead at the time and ofcourse the style of play that wgs had to play as a result of the cost cutting measures. Wgs made mistakes but so has every manager.

Mon left at his height would have been interesting to have seen what he would have done had he stayed another season

 

Hartson-one season left in the tank
Sutton-nothing left in the tank
Lennon-one good season left in the tank
Balde-past his best and sidelined
Stan-He was an asset but he was sold a year later.

Basically they were all past it and close to the end bar Balde

PS Maloney-Gies a break. WGS made him what he became not MON. MON rarely played him. There is no way we can count him an a MON player.

 

Gunt has spoken

 

Rangers were weak under Strachans time here, theres no doubt about that Hearts finished above them one year fucksake

I think it will always come down to because O'Neill had a top quality team who deservedly beat a lot of the best teams in Europe and the fans felt invinisble and we battered everyone in Scotland for 5 years and the Strachan came in and it was a very boring couple of years, we still won but not in any style and not with a quality team or anything then people will just think Strachan was average.

PS I highlighted that bit as the average Wage bill under O'Neill was £35million a year compared to £36.5million under Strachan.

 

MON had lost the title in 2 out of his last 3 seasons on the last day of the season. WGS did it once. I think fans are far from even handed on this and I try my best to level this up. MON had a 75% title winning rate, MON had a 60% one. WGS had a two our of three rate of progressing in the CL. MON had zero out of four or five goes. There is no question than WGS had the midas touch and it only deserted him finally on the last day of his 4 year Celtic career. He had a knack. You just dont get lucky that often. He I think was very clever and had done his homework in how to get more out of less.

 

BORING!

 

Only thing I'm saying, wages. Gordon Strachan's wage bill was higher when he left than MON.

As well as him being able to pay Tommy Gravesen more than Henrik Larsson I don't think that's something you can argue about.

Both Celtic legends though

 

what do you mean we STILL won. MON lost the title in 2 out of 3 seasons before WGS arrived and never progressed in the CL. Immediately on arrival WGS embarked on 3 in a row and 2 CL last 16s in three years. WGS was an absolute miracle worker when you compare the players, many of whom were SPL signings. That is a lot more impressive than the cheque book. Forget arguing over the strength relative to Rangers, WGS got us to the last 16s twice against Europe's finest. WGS remains the only manager to bring us progress in the top level Euro competition in decades.

 

we battered everyone in Scotland for 5 years - we lost 2 out of the last 3 titles MON competed in

We were invincible in Europe but never progressed once in the big boys competition

Fans put the sunniest possible spin on MON and the darkest possible on WGS. Its sad really. Some equality for the ginger ninja please

 

And the only Rangers side to finish 3^rd in a two horse race.

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <wunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <wontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--> The first Rangers side to go an entire month without a victory…

(In the process setting a new club record for most consecutive games without a victory - 9)

Lowest Rangers goal tally since SPL inception.

Yup, some myth.

Also... the Uefa Cup is a horrendous example - they played 8 games en route to the Final and won a mere 2.

And let’s be honest, by 2008, the Uefa Cup had diminished greatly. It was certainly nowhere near the level of competition in 2003.

Post 2005, the Uefa Cup went into massive decline, which saw very poor teams like Middleborough and Rangers reach the Final.

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <wunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <wontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--> Strange then, that this years Rangers side amassed more points in the SPL than any previous Rangers team since 2004/2005.

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Bearing in mind l've got respect for the both of them and what they did for Celtic and forgetting which players they had, what team did you prefer to watch Gunt?

 

See, this is the problem that wgs had, no matter what he was damned if he did and damned if he didn't. I think we should forget about the past and look to a bright future under Lennon. MON and WGS both did great by us under different circumstances. Please stop trying to belittle wgs achievements, leave the man in peace. Let's concentrate on the future with Lennon.

 

What makes this year's Rangers side so weak? They did decently, not spectacularly, in the UEFA Cup. They finished with 93 points in the League, even though they only took four points off of us. The year of Black Sunday, when they had 93 points, they took six points off of us.

They didn't have any great players, they played * football, but they did somehow come up with 89 points against every other team in the league, and that's a really, really high total (higher than any year since the year of Seville).

 

MON gave me the best season I have ever had in 40 years of following Celtic. I have followed Celtic abroad since Aarhus in 82(ish) and nothing will ever take away the pride I had in going to a European final with the club I love.


That said, it is an absolutely pish thread trying to argue one man's achievements against the others.

 

Let's not kid ourselves that Martin O'Neill always faced good Rangers teams, either, though, to be fair.

2003/2004/2005, they had the likes of Henning Berg, Frank deBoer, Francis Jeffers, Gavin Rae, etc.

 

Your basing everything on trophies. it's not all about that.

O'Neill averaged 96 points a season over 5 seasons. Strachan averaged 85 points a season over 4.

Strachan lost 18 SPL games in 4 seasons, O'Neill only lost 15 SPL games in 5 seasons. Martin O'Neill done much much better than Strachan just admit it

All of Martin O'Neill's teams and Lennon's team are better than any of Strachans were imo.