1. Having trouble logging in by clicking the link at the top right of the page? Click here to be taken to the log in page.
    Dismiss Notice

World Cup Qualifying

Discussion in 'World Football' started by Ricardinho, Oct 4, 2009.

Discuss World Cup Qualifying in the World Football area at TalkCeltic.net.

  1. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    I don't think that's ever been brought up even as a possibility. Maybe you're confusing it with Mexican/US competition in Libertadores and Sudamericana?

    Yeah they'll qualify, it's just nice to see them squirm a little bit. :icon_mrgreen:
     
  2. Avatar Daizen The Last Hunskelper Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2011
    Messages:
    10,143
    Likes Received:
    13,543
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Charlie Mulgrew
    Fav Celtic Song:
    The SAM Song
    I'm going to Italy vs Bulgaria on Friday.

    Should be a good game. :50:

    Gutted that Balotelli's suspended though. :54:
     
  3. eire4

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2006
    Messages:
    16,867
    Likes Received:
    6,188
    Location:
    Chicago USA
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson

    No thats not happening. But I have said it before and I will say it again North and South America should be all one zone. Concacaf is a joke as it stands right now so Mexico and the US never have any real pressure games to qualify. You can play like complete crap like Mexico currently are and you know your still going to qualify. For me if the US and Mexico want to be serious about having a real go at a World Cup title then they need real competitive qualifying games to prepare them and you could get that if you merged the 2 regions and turned qualifying into a European style set of groups and playoffs.
     
  4. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    Aye they should take a leaf out of Australia's book :50:
     
  5. pod

    Joined:
    May 19, 2010
    Messages:
    7,881
    Likes Received:
    3
    International football is just a joke full stop but even so, South America is unfair as well. For next year there is a 9 team league and 4 go through automatically and 5th goes into a play off. The will have a minimum of 50% of their teams there and possible 60%. Total farce.


    As its a WORLD cup, there should be no continental barriers for qualifying. I can understand it years ago when transport we more difficult but not now.
     
  6. ILoveTheCeltic

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    53,512
    Likes Received:
    9,289
    Location:
    Republic of Glesga
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Kieran Tierney
    What if there was a World Cup every season and that was all there ever was in International football.

    There is only 207 National teams.

    Surely they can come up with some pre-qualifying set up to leave just 128 teams who play home and away knockout ties over the season.

    Say 128 home and away in September
    Last 64 in October
    Last 32 in November
    Last 16 in December
    Quarters in February
    Semis in April
    Final in May

    Would probably actually be better if International and European football were swapped.

    Imagine a CL tournament at the end of the season?

    Starting in April say, it was just CL games every Tuesday/Wednesday and Saturday/Sunday for 7 weeks.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 4, 2013
  7. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    Disagree. The goal of World Cup qualifying is not to play competitive matches, it is to qualify for a competitive tournament. Confederations should be judged by how many of their teams go on to the knockout stages. As it is, in descending order, those confederations are CONMEBOL (5/5), CONCACAF (2/3), Asia (2/4), UEFA (6/13), Africa (1/6), OFC (0/1). For example, Africa is one of the hardest qualification zones yet their teams fail to progress. CONCACAF is indeed easier for the big four of the US, Mexico, Honduras, and Costa Rica, but they tend to fare well. So if you're concerned about the competition harming the US and Mexico, then thanks but we actually do alright. If you're concerned about giving other "more competitive confederations" slots then you're defeating the purpose of the World Cup.

    Australia actually have an easier, more guaranteed route now than they ever did. If we're getting criticized for having to play away in Central America (never easy to play there, no matter who the opponent is), then why is Australia the model when they played at the powerhouses of Jordan, Oman, and Iraq?

    South America deserve as many slots as they get, if not more. They have the single most competitive qualification and they routinely send the highest proportion of sides through to the knockout rounds. If you're looking for sides to cut down on, it's Africa and UEFA.
     
  8. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    Australia done the right thing, doesn't matter if their qualifying is more liely these days, games against Oman, Iraq and the likes is much MUCH better than facing the likes of Tahiti, New Caledonia and Tonga! The only meaningful games they had other than the World Cup was the occasional game vs NZ and the Playoff to qualify.

    Now they have decent fixtures, against the likes of North and South Korea, Japan, China, Iran, Saudi etc. They won just 3 of their 8 matches in the final group, It was enough to qualify, but it wasn't easy for them.

    The joining of the two federations would be a good thing In my opinion. Would make the Copa America and Qualifying more interesting aswell as scrapping that farce of a football Tournament, the Gold Cup.
     
  9. Seán_67

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Messages:
    5,940
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Teenage Wasteland
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Jinky
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Willie Maley
    So is Osvaldo. Hard to replace the two of them as focal points.

    Gabbiadini may get the nod. I'd like to see wee Insigne starting again in behind the front man, smashing player.
     
  10. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    Obviously, but you were comparing them to CONCACAF, not Oceania.

    They have had to play Japan (37) Oman (95), Saudi (107), Thailand (137), Jordan (71), and Iraq (104) this cycle.

    The US has had (and will have) to play Mexico (20), Costa Rica (42), Honduras (43), Panama (40), Jamaica (76), Guatemala (93), and Antigua/Barbuda (121).

    Plus, the home field advantage in places like Honduras, Mexico, Costa Rica, etc., far outweighs that of Jordan, Oman, Thailand, etc. So better teams with more intimidating stadiums.

    I'd rather see the Gold Cup become a four-year tournament (when it's only two years, one of them [this past one in this case] will be an embarrassment) and for North/Central America to split from the Caribbean.
     
  11. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    I don't know how you can say a team like Mexico going away to the likes of Panama is more daunting than Australia visiting the likes of Jordan. The distance, Culture, and Climate differences make the away games in Asia difficult. They lost in Jordan and Oman not easy places to go by any stretch. Plus the world rankings are a joke, put Guatemala, Jamaica and Panama in a group with Oman, Saudi and Jordan and it would be a close call.

    Something has to be done about the Gold Cup, it really is a joke. If not the qualifiers, they should atleast have the Copa America as a joint federation tournament!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 4, 2013
  12. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    Well first of all it's a longer trip considering that most of Mexico's, US's, and Australia's players are in Europe. Also, I'd rather deal with the dry heat that cools off at night (Jordan) than the heat and humidity that stays with you in Central America. I speak from experience. And last I check Jordanian fans don't throw bags of * at you along with batteries, so that cultural argument isn't holding much sway on me. I found Jordan a lovely, amazing place full of well-behaved people. I'll take that over Central America any day. And even if it would be a close call, you're proving my point that there's not much of a difference.

    The Copa America centenary is supposed to be held in the US I think. But if the Gold Cup were held every four years I wouldn't have a problem with it.
     
  13. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    A chilled bag of * could be just what the players need to Cool them down. :50:

    And The traveling distance can be ridiculous for the Australian players. Even more so than the Americans. Say they have a home game in Australia, then a match in Iraq 4 days later. As you say most players have to travel from outside the country, and especially the players from Europe would have to travel to Australia and then all the way back to the Middle east...Ridiculous travel.I still don't think These places are easy to visit, and it's proven by the results.

    My point was I think the qualifying should be joint, Australia went from Groups of Tahiti, Fiji, Vanuatu etc. To groups of the aforementioned, superior(but not Ideal) teams. I think it would benefit the national teams of USA and Mexico in particular if their regular competitive opponents, went up from the likes of Panama, Guatemala and Bermuda, to the likes of Peru, Venezuela and Colombia. Just like Australia, stepping up a class and making it more exciting for the fans. Lets face it...USA and Mexico are stick-on for every WC qualifying. It's just a bit boring. They'd still more than likely qualify if the federations joined, due to increased places, but at least it would be more exciting and possibly shake-up the competitive, but stale format the South Americans have.

    On the Gold Cup...4 years would certainly be better than every 2. It's a joke of a competition, much like Olympic football.
     
  14. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    :56: Maybe that's why it's so humid in the stadiums.

    True about the traveling distances, but it would be approaching that if the North/South American confederations joined. Europe-DC-Costa Rica-Ohio-Europe is bad enough. What if it were Europe-DC-Chile-Ohio. And my point isn't necessarily that Australia have this cakewalk (although this is the weakest Australia side in years, so that has an impact on their results) but that the US has at least an equally difficult path. Just look at the difference in roster between Costa Rica and Jordan. It's night and day.

    Panama are being underrated by you I think. They beat Mexico in the Gold Cup, have some of MLS' top players, and as football overtakes baseball there you will see better players since it's one of the more developed Central American countries. And you've picked two teams not in the final stage of qualifying as your proof, so that's not entirely fair. The fact is that the "Hex", as it's called, looks a lot like a fairly competitive Asian group. And South Americans do not think their format is stale - they used to have a group format but changed it to a single table format and they are all happy with it. You use Australia's position and results as proof that it's a difficult confederation, but why don't you do the same with, say Mexico? Of their four remaining matches, two of them are the most difficult of the cycle (away to Costa Rica and USA). Jamaica are out of it, but it looks like a tight race between 3 teams (Honduras, Mexico, Panama) for one automatic spot, one playoff spot, and one side goes home. If Mexico is eliminated and fails to go to the World Cup will this somehow validate CONCACAF for you? Or will it instead be used to talk about how * Mexico are? It's just self-fulfilling statements and I get it all the time from people unfamiliar with Central American football. It's hard, the teams are physical and technical, the weather is awful, and the treatment is awful.

    Agreed, but CONCACAF is also unfortunately one of the most corrupt federations in the world - anything that makes more money will be done.
     
  15. OC

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2009
    Messages:
    5,751
    Likes Received:
    1
    Why? Watched it two years ago when Mexico turned the game around in the final vs US and it was an entertaining tournament. Not much quality outside about 5 teams, but it had some quality games.

    If there's a joke of a competition then it's Copa Centroamericana, waste of time and money.
     
  16. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    No, I'm well aware that they are a decent team. I'm familiar with Perez, Baloy and Henriquez. They aren't THAT good though.

    I'm not using it as "proof", just examples, I used Peru and Venezuela also, hardly shining lights of South American football.

    That was more of a personal opinion, I understand that due to lack of nations(9 i think?) this is the best format, but if teams like USA, Mexico, Honduras, Costa Rica etc were in and about it, it could be changed and made more exciting(for me)
    It won't happen though. We both know Mexico will be in Brazil, they always are. Plus I didn't say It's not valid, I just don't really enjoy it. Remember I'm just saying what I'd like to see.

    If it was hard then the big teams would fail to qualify sometimes, I'm sure it's not easy, They may have some tricky games, but it's fairly easy to qualify. You could argue that it's the same for the likes of Japan and Korea, and you'd be right, but I think CONCACAF and CONMEBOL is a more plausible join up than AFC joining with anyone, they have enough countries as it is.

    When I said the Qualifying SHOULD be joint, I should have said, I'd like to see it joint as it'd be more intriguing for me.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 4, 2013
  17. Zander Gold Member Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    23,800
    Likes Received:
    6,382
    Location:
    Irvine
    I mean the fact it's every 2 years, This year Mexico, USA and Hondyras sent really weak teams. It's only taken seriously every 4 years,so why hold it every 2? That's why it's a joke.
     
  18. OC

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2009
    Messages:
    5,751
    Likes Received:
    1
    Oh that, I agree. Continental international tournaments should be held as long apart as possible, 4 years would be ideal. African Cup of Nations is held too often, it waters down what is generally a great competition. Copa America got it right, 4 year gap make people anticipate it more.
     
  19. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    Money, same as the ACoN. And the US, CR, Honduras, and Mexico use it as a good opportunity to blood younger and "B-team" players.
     
  20. Diegan

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    8,192
    Likes Received:
    235
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Henrik Larsson
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    The Copa Centroamericana is just one of many regional tournaments. There's the East Asian Cup, the Asian Challenge Cup or something, the Arab Cup, the Caribbean Cup. They're usually used for CONCACAF and Asia as qualifiers for the Gold Cup and Asia Cup, so they serve a bit of a purpose since we don't have an official qualifying process like Europe, nor have a tournament that encompasses the entire continent like CONMEBOL.