[Matchday] Livingston V Celtic, Sun 11th Nov KO 12 pm, Live on Sky Sports Football

Ridiculous excuse.

 

and why is that

 

Blaming a pitch for dropping points.

 

Fact is Livingston play on it all the time , its the same with hamilton and kilmarnock is whats keeping them in the league these pitches , if you look at their away results over a period of time i bet its not as good, and players are going to get seriously hurt on it.

 

Disagree with you here mate.

I've been to Lennoxtown and to Livingston and there is a fair disparity in terms of the quality of the surface. Livingston's is genuinely worse than the council-run pitches at the side of Clyde's stadium that I play on each week.

The bounce of the ball is unnatural and players were constantly slipping. The likes of Edouard, Rogic, McGregor who can usually turn on a button were having to take extra steps to rotate on that pitch for fear of decking it.

It's no coincidence that 3 of our worst performances this season have came on the 3 worst playing surfaces, Killie (plastic) Livingston (plastic) Hearts (grass uncut for weeks)

We can still play on them and have won games in the past but they are definitely a leveller and stunt our normal slick passing game.

 

Normally I get raging dropping points against teams like Livingston but if you told me 5/6 weeks ago that we would be top of the league and our Europa hopes would still alive before the International Break I would have taken that. So overall satisfied with how things are.

Players need a well deserved break and hopefully Brown, Ntcham and Griffiths will all be fighting fit come the next game to add competition for places. That was another thing about yesterday, our players were tired and there was a lack of options on the bench in an attacking sense. Personally I would have kept Forrest on and replaced Sinclair. I'd have also brought Hayes on, he needs more chances.

 

and first trophy of the season to be won wich would be 7 straight , weve had worse days i suppose.:brendy:

 

So what?

Did these guys grow up playing football on bowling greens?

There's lads from Glasgow in this team that would have grown up playing on concrete, * as well probably grew up playing football in their bare feet ffs.

They should be able to adapt to playing on ANY surface.

There's no way I'll accept it as any excuse, although yes it will alter their game slightly.

 

Usually we do grind out results on those types of surfaces but they absolutely play a part and it's hard to adapt to how bad the Livingston pitch really is. Even in plastic pitch terms it's utter dogshit.

We should still have had enough to win the game. A number of other variables played their part with their GK having the game of his life or the officials not spotting Menga headbutt.

I'm disappointed with yesterday's result but I'm not going to have a go at the team or management for it. It was miles apart from our 0-0 v St Mirren or 0-1 v Kilmarnock when there was a severe lack of effort or creativity. On another day we would've won comfortably yesterday.

We've definitely turned a corner and I think come the winter break there'll be a sizeable gap between us and the also-rans.

Going forward though if we're trying to improve the standard of the game and sell the product to broadcasters then plastic pitches should be universally barred from the top flight.

 

I'm certainly in no way favouring plastic pitches, I * hate them but I can understand why it's a viable option for some of these smaller teams who don't have anywhere near enough money to have decent pitches and stadiums, so we have to play on what we have to play on.

I reiterate, these aren't the WORST surfaces to play on, especially when growing up having to endure playing on red ash pitches in the freezing winters with a mitre mouldmaster.

Some of these * would collapse with a heart attack if you asked them to play in those conditions...

 

Thing is, it's a chicken and egg scenario.

Clubs are going in for plastic pitches as the finances are stretched from poor TV income which then damage the standard of our game.

TV broadcasters won't pay more for the game unless there's a appreciable rise in quality.

On that basis we need a wee bit of courage and foresight from these clubs to take a unified approach to ban them and I'm certain in the long run we'll see the benefits.

 

I don't really think WE can take too much of a moral high ground over how clubs go about their business the best way they can, and especially since (albeit to a FAR superior degree) we have part-artificial grass.

I certainly agree though the state of this league and sponsorship/tv rights etc is pre-historic.

 

I don't see it as a moral point. It negatively affects every club in the league including us. Nobody outwith a Celtic and Livingston persuasion would've stuck with that game yesterday. TV companies know that and don't pay a premium. So we're being directly financially disadvantaged.

I think there needs to be a full review about how we improve Scottish Football as a spectacle and by extension interest in our game beyond the UK/Ireland. Surfaces would play a part in that, as would officials, as would scheduling of games.

If we can demonstrate to these clubs that it's in their own best interests in the medium to long term to scrap the pitches then we'll be moving in the right direction.

If they dig their heels in, stick their fingers in their ears and refuse to listen then we'll keep getting stitched up by TV companies and we'll probably see more clubs go down the plastic route.

 

I don't see why a club cannot afford a grass pitch. I have a season ticket to Hanwell Town (English 8th tier) a semi pro team, they have a new fantastic pitch and it cost 75k to J stall (a grant was given). It is better than many league pitches and has a fantastic drainage system the same as man city's. I don't buy that a Scottish premiership team cannot afford one.

 

They can but the maintenance will be much less (basically nil given the nick of it) on a surface like Livingston's, meaning they can save the annual salary of a greenkeeper.

Also the hire possibilities for a plastic pitch bring in another income stream, say a conservative estimate of £50 per hire and an average of 14 per week, works out at £700 gross income per week, or £36,400 per year less costs.

Essentially a grass pitch is a net drain on club finances whereas a plastic pitch is in most cases a net contributor. What we need to do is make a strong argument that while removing these plastic pitches will affect finances in the short-term, in doing so it will improve the standard of our game and allow us to push for a better TV deal in the long-term.

 

Under soil heating used to a prerequisite for the top flight and it should be again.

Maybe the clubs could use some of the cash we earn them from European football to make their pitch better.

 

Never knew anything about minimum capacity, obviously they had to be all seaters. Think the issue is during the Winter unless they have undersoil heating a lot of games would be called off. Must be more expensive to install and maintain undersoil heating than a plastic pitch.

Plenty of clubs manage it tho and if it means no chance of promotion into the SPL clubs like Killie would defo install it. Playing on it all the time must be an unfair advantage too and probably a reason why Hamilton have survived and Livi are so hard to beat.

Would rather have the likes of Thistle(s), Dundee U, Dunfermline etc in the league purely for their pitch.

 

I think Falkirk were denied promotion twice, 97/98 and 03/04 both because Brockville wasn't a 10,000 all-seater stadium. I think in the following season they reduced the criteria to 6,000